Monday, October 1, 2007

Thomas H. Naylor: "Obviously A Good Confederate"

I received a message last week regarding an unusual Naylor sighting.   It seems that the Second Vermont Republic's founder, Thomas H. Naylor had been booked for a segment (scroll to just past the mid-point of the program where his segment starts) on a well-known hate radio program called The Political Cesspool on Memphis' WLRM during TPC's month long "celebration" of Confederate History Month this past April.   The show's host, James Edwards, is a longtime racist, anti-Semetic, white supremacist, white separatist activist [1] [2] whose Confederate History Month broadcasts were sometimes also hosted by his friend and associate Winston Smith, reputed to be the well known white supremacist and former head of the neo-Nazi group, the National Socialist White People's Party, also known as Harold Covington.  Maybe, maybe not, but it wouldn't be surprising considering that Edwards' guest list reads like a Who's Who of America's anti-civil rights, anti-Semetic, neo-Confederate, neo-Nazi, white supremacist, white separatist, racist, umm, cesspool:
Michael Hill, the League of the South president

Thomas DiLorenzo, a Second Vermont Republic advisory board member, a League of the South member and instructor at the LoS Institute for the Study of Southern History and Culture, as well as an anti-civil rights, anti-union writer.  Here's a recent promotion of Edward's program at the notorious Stormfront.org hatesite featuring the SVR's DiLorenzo. NOTE: Stormfront often takes down these links after they discover that people they consider unsympathetic to their "cause" are using them, so don't be surprised if it's gone missing when you get there.

Gordon Baum, CEO of the Council of Conservative Citizens (formerly known as the Whites Citizen's Council)

Steve McIntyre, a reenactor whose specialty is Confederate Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest, who founded the Ku Klux Klan and is reputed to have ordered the massacre of black POWs during the Civil War

Larry Pratt, an anti-Semitic, white supremacist, militia advocate

J. Stanley Lott, a slavery/Lincoln history revisionist

Sam Dickson, a former Ku Klux Klan lawyer and a Holocaust denier, Lincoln history revisionist and Council of Conservative Citizens member

Ted Pike, a Cesspool regular, anti-Semite and white supremacist (for a taste of his anti-Semetic bile, watch this or this)
A few of the other past "guests" on Edwards' show:
David Duke, who needs no introduction; read the praise that the people at his website give Edwards here

Mark Weber, a renown Holocaust denier

Jamie Kelso, a racist, anti-Semite, neo-Nazi kingpin at the notorious Stormfront.org website

Peter Gemma, a Council of Conservative Citizens member

Robert Barkdoll, a white supremacist and head of the Missouri League of the South chapter

Peter J. Peters, a Christian Identity leader, white supremacist and anti-Semite

... and many, many more of this bigoted, hateful ilk
For the first time in the Edwards interview Naylor admits to having commissioned his methodologically challenged poll of Vermonters on the subject of secession, conducted for him by UVM's Center for Rural Studies.  You can see for yourself Naylor's questionable, paid for, 2006 Vermonter Poll questions that he often refers to as a UVM poll in a third person manner that doesn't disclose his direct involvement or reveal UVM's contract-only relationship to his poll. [3] [4]  Naylor now says:
"A year ago we commissioned a statewide poll (to be conducted) by the University of Vermont to find out how many secessionists there were in Vermont."
According to his "poll," 47 people said they would support secession and from that he has extrapolated that tens of thousands of Vermonters directly support secession.  When you add to the equation his "thumb on the scale" questionable methodology and the margin for error, it's more likely that the true number of supporters could meet in a phone booth.

Naylor continued:
"We're always asked, "How many people support your cause?" and we didn't know.  The answer one year ago was 8% of the eligible voters supported secession.  One year later that number had jumped from 8% to 13%."
"Jumped?"  Let's not extrapolate too much there, Tom.  If you bothered to factor in the two polls margins for error, you haven't even filled that phone booth yet.  Your increase could be, in fact, a decrease.  Once again Naylor is keeping the actual poll questions for the 2007 poll to himself as he did with the 2006 poll.   He has to since he's no doubt employed the same type of cheesy polling questions as he did last year.

As if to underscore his complete detachment from the real political world in Vermont, Naylor states that his goal and strategy is,
"(T)o persuade the (Vermont) state legislature to convene a convention... convened to consider one issue, namely articles of secession."
He goes on to say that he envisions a 2/3 to 3/4 vote of the 180 or 200 members at that convention being needed in support of the articles of secession for them to be passed credibly. He believes that this can and will happen in Vermont and at the Legislature's behest.

Yeah, right.  And he's got his political ace, Peter Moss, working on that.

Later in the interview, Naylor repeats one of his regular talking points about the dissolution of the "Soviet empire" and the six satellite states shaking off their "shackles" and asserting their independence [5], which got Edwards all warm and fuzzy, saying, "What can happen in Europe can easily happen here."

What?  Don't any of these guys know that as soon as those six countries shook off those shackles they immediately joined NATO and European Union, a mega-state of nearly 500 million people?  I'm beginning to think that they're all missing a few stars and bars.

Now before the "let's not have any guilt by association" crowd gets all lathered up, I should point out that Naylor did not just participate in the broadcast.  He acknowledge knowing that his interview was a part of a series of interviews for Confederate History Month (see companion guest list above that was available to him at the time) and he later asked for contact information from Edwards so that he could keep in touch with these scum.  Moreover, Naylor has been pretty diligent about posting on his website his appearances, interviews and press.  Actually, he's been something of a media whore about it, and yet oddly this one didn't seem make into his media scrapbook.  Nor has Rob Williams at "Vermont Commons" been crowing about the interview on his blog, as he usually does whenever someone in the media mentions SVR. Why's that, Tom?  You too, Rob.  Why is it that I always have to dig up the dirt for Vermonters?  Why did you hide from this one?

Fortunately, Edwards & company ran out of time before Naylor could launch into another one of his self-described "fantasies" about Vermont seceding and then joining the Canadian Atlantic provinces to form a new country that he calls New Acadia. [6]

At the risk of transgressing Godwin's Rule, all this talk about Europe with a couple of white separatists whose programs are feature at a neo-Nazi website with a man who has a weak grasp of European history and some far fetch fantasies about redrawing the map of North America reminds me of another mid-20th century European who moved nonexistent armies around maps of his make believe empire while eastern European artillery pounded his bunker.

Edwards closes the program calling Naylor a "good confederate" and, while acknowledging a female guest from an earlier segment of the show, he admits that
"(A) lot of the times (sic) The Political Cesspool is like a prism... it's all male; it's all white."
Prism probably isn't what he meant but I'm sure he'd be the first to say that metaphorically speaking, he's not a bright light.  Nor can Thomas Naylor be called particulary bright for having done this interview.

Update (10/4): Two months after the Naylor visit to the nasty, racist Political Cesspool radio hate show, Kirkpatrick Sale, Middlebury Institute partner of Thomas H. Naylor, did a segment with the Cesspool host, James Edwards and his co-host Eddie "The Bombardier" Miller, on the July 2, 2007 Political Cesspool show.   You'll need to wade through a half hour of bigoted bile where Edwards and Miller first joke about napalming liberals and then move on to heap praise David Duke, calling him "(A) great friend of ours & a great man," along with saying toward the end of the program, "We are blessed to have a good friendship with the Duke people and Duke himself," as well as describing the "Duke-meister" as "(O)ne of our heroes; one of our good friends."   The reading of fan mail comes at the end of the show, like one listener's paean of sorts to their show's musical selections (always white), who signs himself as being from "OntariJew, the Zionist Republic of Canada," and who they thank profusely for his comments.   When Miller compares Bush to Hitler, Edwards chastises Miller to not disrepect "the German gentleman," and later Edwards goes onto critcize "the media, the establishment, Zionist press."   Yuck!

Sale does the usual fan dance employing all the familiar talking points: a poll "by university people" without ever mentioning the that the four questions were written and paid for by his friend Naylor (with possible input from himself); the ludicrous notion that the Vermont legislature will overwhelming vote to secede; that Vermonters, by some kind of referendum process not presently provided for under the state constitution will also vote overwelming for secession; an appeal to the UN for recognition (of whom Naylor has said, "It's hard to imagine a more impotent institution than the... UN"; etc., ad nauseum.

If you have the stomach for it, research for yourself as I have some of the sponsors and promotional spots on the program. It's an eye-opening look at the type of folks Sale and Naylor value contact with more than the Vermonters that have been purged from the SVR.

11 Comments:

At Tuesday, October 2, 2007 at 10:48:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Chip Berlet! You are doing a great job. Keep it UP.
Fat Bureaucrat

 
At Wednesday, October 3, 2007 at 11:09:00 AM EDT , Blogger Thomas Rowley said...

Wrong but keep trying. If you do know Chip, say hi for me. ;)

T.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 12:27:00 AM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ranting that everyone who is a little conservative or libertarian, fed up with the govt and wanting to secede is a racist is as absurd as say that every peacenik who associates with and doesn't speak out against leftist throwing things at cops at peace or anti-globalization protests is a violent communist trying to impose a stalinist state through street violence. Which of course is what some right wingers claim. Polarization for political purposes is an old game, played particularly well by the Nazis vs. the Commies leading up to the rise of Hitler.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 2:46:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article3028714.ece
Gee, Mark Potok himself is from Vermont. How's the fundrai$ing going Mark? Manufacturing fear -- out in the open or anonymously -- is a great way to raise money, isn't it? Look how great it's been for George Bush and his war on Muslims/Arabs.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 2:51:00 PM EDT , Blogger Thomas Rowley said...

>>Ranting that everyone who is a little conservative or libertarian, fed up with the govt and wanting to secede is a racist is as absurd as say(ing) that every peacenik who associates with and doesn't speak out against leftist throwing things at cops at peace or anti-globalization protests is a violent communist trying to impose a stalinist state through street violence.<<

What your mischaracterization omits is that I am saying that making nice with bigots, racists and anti-Semites is very open to discussion and criticism. If you're comfortable with doing so, that's your problem. I don't care what your politics are; if you find common cause with sources whose bigotry is open to see for all, don't be surprised if that's found by many to be repugnant.

>>Which of course is what some right wingers claim. Polarization for political purposes is an old game, played particularly well by the Nazis vs. the Commies leading up to the rise of Hitler.<<

Ahh, so strategizing, affirming and working closely with American neo-Nazi supporters of David Duke won't lead to the rise of a Hitler in an American secession state?

Maybe your inspiration was Stalin's saying, "You cannot make a revolution with silk gloves," eh?

Feel free to stop by and rail incongruously anytime.

T.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 4:23:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Perhaps the ranter was responding to your indiscriminate listing of people who are not known to be haters or have one or two minor faux pas in the past, so minor that only Mark Potok or his ilk would even know about it. Or maybe you just hate capitalists. It's possible to expose real racists and convince them to change their ways or convince others to disassociate with them without smearing anyone who may have some minor association with them. THAT is probably what is meant by being divisive. Keep it up and you'll see the black blockers and the militias fighting it out in the street -- oh, no, that's right they ALL hate the government. Even the Gathering of Eagles may have trouble supporting HILLARY's War. And have a fit when Hillary OR Rudy tries to take their guns away. The revolution IS coming against an increasingly facist state and all Mark and his friends whining about it can't stop it. 2010-2012 are going to be TOO Exciting.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 4:25:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Hoo Ya! said...

If Mark Potok's family still lives in vermont he's probably paranoid that some 8th generation Green Mountain man will come after them if he doesn't find a less SPLC way of dealing with real issues and real problems. Think about it Mark.

 
At Saturday, October 6, 2007 at 5:48:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Candy said...

Yes, Mark, think about treating people better. I mean having Green Mountain men doing Gandhian starvation fasts outside your home or SLPC office, in Vt or the South, where ever it might be, could actually trigger your CONSCIENCE. Of course, the Patriot Act has almost outlawed that traditional Indian form of personal witness.

The issue is not right wing racists who MIGHT secede and stop paying taxes, but the right wing anti-muslim/arab racists NOW in the white house armed with nukes and looking to first strike china and russia - right after they nuke iran and pakistan!

 
At Sunday, October 7, 2007 at 11:06:00 AM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just read a couple articles about secession conference and through wiki got to this page. Interesting exchange. However, I have to wonder if you are not making libelous claims by attacking everyone and his brother who isn't a liberal democrat as racists. Sure, racists who make explicit racist statements should be exposed and you seem to do that, but this top post and your links tar everyone and their brother. PLus you link to groups that have cried wolf so often, or abused innocent people like Jimmy Carter or Desmond Tutu, that no serious person takes them seriously.
REader

 
At Sunday, October 7, 2007 at 11:36:00 AM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

It seems that if there are real concerns you are trying to communicate, you would set up a separate page that would like these individuals, links to evidence of allegations you make, etc. in an easily identifiable way. Who is going to try to make their way through all these blog entries. ONly people searching internet for specific info might find most of yours. Why not set up your own page with all this so people can better use and evaluate it??

 
At Sunday, October 7, 2007 at 1:31:00 PM EDT , Anonymous Anonymous said...

You do NOT have to BE Mark Potok of SPLC to copy a bunch of stuff from his web pages. (However a zabasearch.com does show what seems to be one couple named POTOK in Vermont.) Anyone with a little time and blogging ability and a leftist desire to crush dissent from any human who doesn't believe in Karl Marx is all you need - but make sure you call it something noble like crushing racism. It does sound like a good idea to have a page where all this info is listed and links are easy to follow so we can see if this is hype or not.
gee whiz

 

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